The Krib
Apistogramma/Dwarf Cichlids
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The Krib
Apistogramma/Dwarf Cichlids
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Laetacara curvicepsContents:
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photos by Helen Burns
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Hello All:
I've bred L. curviceps and realized some curious behaviours I'd like to
share and some questions about it:
They spawned in a communitary tank, 100 l., pH 6 and 4º gH, about
28ºC, a well established tank with Java moss, Java fern, Anubias,
Salvinias, wood, rocks, etc. Spawning place was a wood, eggs hatched in
2 days and free swimming fry in three or four days (hundreds of them!),
I removed the other fishes, but 3 brachidanio rerio left in tank (I
couldn't catch them), as "dither fish". Feeding fry with BBS since
second free swimming day, the first one they ate some "infusoria" should
be in the tank.
The B. Rerio attacks the fry, until parents realized, so they become
fish food instead of dither fish, they were dead and eaten in less than
24 h., I thought Curviceps were a peaceful fish.
I've seen some "white dots" in father's body, and fry's seems to eat
of, could this be something like discus?. Right now, about 3 weeks from
free swimming the dots have disappeared.
Parents are eating sand snails, the big ones, I think they try to
catch them when snail is out, as they can't break the shell.
Yesterday I decided to take the fry's (they are quite big and with a
bit of colour already) to other tank, for I want to put the fishes I
removed first, but I had two problems, first, I couldn't catch every fry
(there are still a lot, more than 200), and in second place, they have
spawned again, in the same place, so I left the fry's I hadn't caught
and took of.
This morning I've seen the fry's I've left in the tank swimming
round the eggs, and eating the unfertilized ones, their parents allowed
them. Any idea? There is (I think) food enough for the fry's, so I don't
think it would be any kind of supplement food like in Chana orientalis,
besides, there are a lot of (apparently) fertilized eggs.
Any comment would be of interest.
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Beverly Erlebacher wrote: > > This morning I've seen the fry's I've left in the tank swimming > > round the eggs, and eating the unfertilized ones, their parents > allowed > > them. Any idea? There is (I think) food enough for the fry's, so I > don't > > think it would be any kind of supplement food like in Chana > orientalis, > > besides, there are a lot of (apparently) fertilized eggs. > > This is a remarkable observation. Let us know what happens next! Well, the fertilized eggs hatched, and parents made some digs to move the fry, and moved them, but it seems that they were very tasty to the old fry's, so they ate them, and parents didn't care, as they allowed them to do it, now I've got just the old fry's I left in the tank, I think next time I'll use the bottle trap. In other tank I've got some (about 30) A. resticulosa fry's with parents, free swimming about 3 weeks, it was everything OK, but this evening I've seen less fry's, and the male was chasing the female, however, he didn't care of fry's, should I remove the male, or the female, or the fry's? Thanks, Antonio ------------------------------------------------------------------------- This is the apistogramma mailing list, apisto-at-majordomo.pobox.com. For instructions on how to subscribe or unsubscribe or get help, email apisto-request-at-majordomo.pobox.com. Search http://altavista.digital.com for "Apistogramma Mailing List Archives"!
Hi People! The pH in my 60-gal. Rio Negro tank crashed - it used to be in the mid to upper 5s. My Pinpoint pH meter now reads 2.98 to 3.10. Yes, it is calibrated. This evening I found a clutch of 250 or so eggs from my second pair of Laetacara sp. Orange Fin from Rio Negro! Who'd have thunk it?! Everybody looks happy, except the other nervous pair of Orange Fin just a foot away, guarding about 60 six-week old fry. I set this tank up with mostly RO water and threw in the two pairs to breed them. I wanted to study their broodcare behavior when exposed to a) conspecifics (members of the same species) and b) two different predators from their natural habitat namely Crenicichla notophthalmus (dwarf pike) and a Hypselecara coryphaenoides juvenile (the other Chocolate cichlid). I've been keeping a log titled 'Attack sorties by broodcaring Laetacara sp. Orange Fin' where I've broken down the parents' aggression into posturing, biteless rushes and bites etc. The Chocolate cichlid is the least harassed, the second pair of Orange Fins in between and the dwarf pikes have been mercilessly attacked. The second pair could have spawned further away from the first pair with the fry but the other end of the tank is dominated by a mean dwarf pike. Looks like they'd rather spawn next to each other and risk competition rather than spawn next to the pike's lair and risk getting eaten! Of course, these are just my thoughts but I'll tabulate all the details/numbers and publish it in the ACARA, Journal of the South American Cichlid Study Group. For more info on the study group, check out my web site, Mostly Cichlids: http://www.geocities.com/NapaValley/5491/ Anybody else get a spawn right after a major pH crash? Was it also a blackwater species? BTW, the Water Sprite (yeah, I know it is not from Rio Negro) is still hanging in there. Oh yeah, I remembered, finally, to scrape off a few eggs for Ron Coleman's Cichlid Egg Project. Go to cichlidresearch.com and check out what it is all about. It's pretty neat. Vinny kutty@earthlink.net -----Original Message----- From: Russell E. Stevens, III <topgun3@gte.net> To: apisto@majordomo.pobox.com <apisto@majordomo.pobox.com> Date: Friday, December 18, 1998 7:55 PM Subject: breeding microgeophagus ram. and kribenses >i am a novice both at using this site an beeding these fish...would >appreciate any help incl ph, hardnes and best food to "condition" >my breeding pairs (blue rams + krib) > > >thanks very much for your help, russ > > >------------------------------------------------------------------------- >This is the apistogramma mailing list, apisto@majordomo.pobox.com. >For instructions on how to subscribe or unsubscribe or get help, >email apisto-request@majordomo.pobox.com. >Search http://altavista.digital.com for "Apistogramma Mailing List Archives"! > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- This is the apistogramma mailing list, apisto@majordomo.pobox.com. For instructions on how to subscribe or unsubscribe or get help, email apisto-request@majordomo.pobox.com. Search http://altavista.digital.com for "Apistogramma Mailing List Archives"!
V Kutty wrote: > > John, > Could you please describe the fish? Rosemary Lowe-McConnell's Laetacara sp. > 7-stripe MAY be Buckelkopf...they kinda have some stripes on them. If they > are the same fish, someone is probably breeding them - they are not that > hard to breed - they complied for me at pH 8. > > Vinny Vinny, Last year by July I was with a German friend (Hans Evers) in the same region visited by Lowe-McConnell. We collected what she called 7-stripe Laetacara, and it seems to be the same fish found in the middle Araguaia that is currently in the hobby (= Buckelkopf). Hans told me that Frank Warzel has seen them, and agrees the 7-stripe is identical to Buckelkopf. Interesting from the same region is Aequidens sp. "Xavantina", also listed by Lowe-McConnell. And of course the odd C. rosemariae, that we were unable to catch ------------------------------------------------------------------------- This is the apistogramma mailing list, apisto@majordomo.pobox.com. For instructions on how to subscribe or unsubscribe or get help, email apisto-request@majordomo.pobox.com. Search http://altavista.digital.com for "Apistogramma Mailing List Archives"!
Stan Jamrog wrote: > Hi all! I am new to this list and am interested in breeding dwarf > cichlids (hope I sent this to the right place) > First here are my water parameters: ph of 6.8, and gh of 50-80 ppm > Here are the fish I would like breeding info on: > Laetacara Buckelkopf (F1): > I have two pair of these in 10 gallon tanks with sponge filters: > What temp range is good for breeding? How can I definitively tell male > from female? Any info appreciated. A 10 gallon tank is kind of small for a dwarf acara. L. sp. Buckelkopf can have 500 eggs in a spawn! I've bred this species in a 20L in similar water conditions, but I'd drop the pH to below 6.5 @ ~80ºF (27ºC). Young males & females look very much alike, but after a year or so the males will be larger and not look as "plump". Males will also have long posterior dorsal fin extensions. > Laetacara Thayeri (F0): I have five of these fish in a 29. I know > absolutely nothing about these fish, would like any info, esp: breeding 5 in a 29 is probably OK when they are small, but this fish can get to almost 6" in an aquarium. I've never bred this fish, but have bred L. flavilabris, the ugly sister of L. thayeri. These fish show a preference for vertical surfaces to breed on, like angels and severums. My L. flavilabris usually spawned on an old plastic Amazon Sword Plant. Water needed to be pH < 5.5 with virtually no hardness @ ~80ºF (27ºC) before showing any interest in spawning. > Dicrossus Maculatas (F0): I have a trio of these in a heavily planted > 20 long. I would dearly love to breed them. Any ideas? How about > ideal temp range for breeding? Tank size is fine. Drop the pH<5.5 and reduce your hardness by half and you should do fine. Same temperature as above should be OK. Offer caves & hidden vertical surfaces. Different fish prefer different spawning sites. Good luck with your fish Mike Wise > > > All these fish receive the following foods: Tetramin pro. beef heart > recipe I use for my discus, and the occasional live white worm treat. > I also own a mated pair of Pelvichromis Taeniatus "Moliwe", but they > seem to breed easily enough. Thank you in advance for your attention. > Stan > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > This is the apistogramma mailing list, apisto@majordomo.pobox.com. > For instructions on how to subscribe or unsubscribe or get help, > email apisto-request@majordomo.pobox.com. > Search http://altavista.digital.com for "Apistogramma Mailing List Archives"!
Stan wrote: > Laetacara Thayeri (F0): I have five of these fish in a 29. I know > absolutely nothing about these fish, would like any info, esp: breeding These guys are pretty big for dwarf cichlids but are not very aggressive. They are not picky about what they eat but are quite shy and bash about the tank if you move too fast. They are less skittish in crowded tanks but make sure they are the dominant fish in the tank. Your water parameters should be just fine for breeding - a temp of about 80-85F should be fine for breeding. I have 8 wild caught fish from Peru and have pampered them for almost 10 now but no spawns. Should have give them Mike Jacobs! Wayne Leibel says these fish have not been bred in North America but my guess is if we beat the bushes, we'll find someone who has...most likely on this list. Vinny Kutty kutty@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/NapaValley/5491/
In a message dated 7/22/1999 5:29:56 AM Mountain Daylight Time, francinebethea@excite.com writes: > How can you tell with curviceps? I have always loved this fish. However, I > always end up with males. I just got rid of a beautiful pair of males. > Francine in MD > > > does anyone know how to distinguish male and females in these 2 spp.? i > can > > tell with curviceps but not with these two. thanks. > > > > tsuh yang chen, nyc > > Francine, If you can't tell, how do you know they were males?:-) The dorsal should be slightly more pointed at the back on all three. Other than that, you have to feed mature specimens heavily and look at the tube that sticks out the bottom Bob Dixon ------------------------------------------------------------------------- This is the apistogramma mailing list, apisto@listbox.com. For instructions on how to subscribe or unsubscribe or get help, email apisto-request@listbox.com. Search http://altavista.digital.com for "Apistogramma Mailing List Archives"!
Bob, But surely the "tube" only appears when they are about to spawn. Therefore if you only have the one sex this will not happen. Helen >The dorsal should be slightly more pointed at the back on all three. Other >than that, you have to feed mature specimens heavily and look at the tube >that sticks out the bottom > >Bob Dixon
I have to add my 2 cents here on the topic of tubes down. Helen mentioned that if one has it's tube down this doesn't happen when there is only one sex present. I have to disagree somewhat here. I'm not sure as far as Thayeri or Dorsiger are concerned, but I've seen "Pairs" of 2 females with tubes down laying eggs along with 2 female discus doing the say. No males present in either tank. I think that with the need to get rid of eggs it won't matter to some species whether a male is present or not. I've had single ram female lay eggs with no male present. Never had this happen with any Apistos yet, but i say yet. Fuel for thought, not trying to be a smart .... here Helen. John
Helen writes: > But surely the "tube" only appears when they are about to spawn. Therefore > if you only have the one sex this will not happen. > Helen It's been my experience with dorsiger that if you feed them good stuff and lots of it at once, they will fill up enough for the tube to extend slightly. Bob ------------------------------------------------------------------------- This is the apistogramma mailing list, apisto@listbox.com. For instructions on how to subscribe or unsubscribe or get help, email apisto-request@listbox.com. Search http://altavista.digital.com for "Apistogramma Mailing List Archives"!
Finally, after trying to get my Laetacara thayeri to spawn for almost two years, they did the dirty deed!
The pH was about 6 and the hardness was about 100 microSiemens. 60-gal. tank, lots of floating water sprite and driftwood. They were fed live adult brine shrimp, live daphnia every week but mostly Tetrabits (or what ever they're calling it now). Basically the same conditions I had maintained over the last 18 months or so. =20
What triggered the spawn now?
Well, I tore down the elaborate photography scaffolding gizmo I had set up to photograph them...they were too shy - if they saw me, they would hide. I managed to get some pics but not in spawning coloration. (spawning coloration is the same pattern but with more contrast) Other than that, I added a mated pair of Keyhole cichlids to the tank and a bunch more dithers. The dithers were actually a rare tetra that I saw in the habitat where I collected the thayeri. I saw a bunch of them in a store in Sacramento, California (Capitol Aquarium) and I got them. =20
I think the additional fish in the tank made them feel more comfortable and that is what triggered the spawn. =20
I'll have pics of these and L. flavilabris on my site one of these days.
Vinny
BTW, if any of you go to San Jose area, California, do visit Dolphin Pet Village. They have at least 20 species of Apistos! sp. Algodon, Cara Pintada, iniridae, sp. Xingu, T-bars, etc, etc. The fish weren't as healthy as in Ocean Aquarium in San Francisco but the variety was on par or better. I spent 4 hours there this weekend and I didn't even venture into the reptile or bird sections.=20
Thanks, Helen. It is certainly the dithers that did it. I had about a dozen tetras in there before but I didn't want to add any more because I wanted to keep the population density low and the water clean. The number of dithers obviously didn't make them feel very secure before. There appears to be a security threshold that the addition of more dithers helped cross. Now, with about 20 dithers, the fish are not shy!! They still scoot away when I approach the tank quickly but they dont scoot too far away and come out into the open right away. They're also begging for food more vigorously. =20
I'm relearning a lot of things about fishkeeping. :-) I think the 'quality' of dithers is important too. Having a dozen sedentary tetras like Crenuchus spilurus (which I also remember seeing along with the thayeri) in the tank is not the same as a dozen Triportheus (Giant hatchets). The key qualifications for dithers should be 'active' and 'tight-schooling. ' I cant find a name for the tetras I just added to the tank. They are shaped like Iguanodectes but with a brownish cream body and a red tail like in Prionobrama filigera...Randy are you out there? I couldn't find a picture of them in Baensch atlases 1-4...may be 5 has it.=20
Whatever they are, they work!
Vinny
Helen wrote:
Vinny,
Congratulations. Our species know what they want and we have the job of finding out exactly what it is. Your Thayeri are happy now and it will be all go from now on. I'm happy for you and the fish, I can almost hear you cheering from here.
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